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NCSE Reactions to creation "museum"

 
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Sir Hamster of Elderberry
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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2007 3:12 pm    Post subject: NCSE Reactions to creation "museum" Reply with quote

National Center for Science Education - Reactions to creation "museum"

http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/news/2007/KY/563_reactions_to_creation_museum_5_25_2007.asp
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belenus
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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2007 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it's a little of an offense to say that "creationists" are lunatics.
As I consider myself a looney, and as far as I know looney comes from lunatic, I don't want to share that definition with this kind of living-in-the-fifteenth-century people.
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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2007 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

belenus wrote:
I think it's a little of an offense to say that "creationists" are lunatics.
As I consider myself a looney, and as far as I know looney comes from lunatic, I don't want to share that definition with this kind of living-in-the-fifteenth-century people.


ROFLMAO!!!

that said...

As science is based around observational proof of theories...

if man was created on the sixth day, who was around to see what happened of the first five eh?.... therefore the scientific case for creationism cannot be proven..... God could have made it all up..... it's that damn cat in a box all over again!!

however where creationists have missed a trick in my book is asking the question ....

What and who caused the big bang??...
and
Where did all those dimensions come from??

#ni-1 #ni-1
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Sir Hamster of Elderberry
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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2007 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KWSN - Sir Brian C....... wrote:
...

What and who caused the big bang??...
and
Where did all those dimensions come from??




Wink
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belenus
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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2007 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KWSN - Sir Brian C....... wrote:
belenus wrote:
I think it's a little of an offense to say that "creationists" are lunatics.
As I consider myself a looney, and as far as I know looney comes from lunatic, I don't want to share that definition with this kind of living-in-the-fifteenth-century people.


ROFLMAO!!!

that said...

As science is based around observational proof of theories...

if man was created on the sixth day, who was around to see what happened of the first five eh?.... therefore the scientific case for creationism cannot be proven..... God could have made it all up..... it's that damn cat in a box all over again!!

however where creationists have missed a trick in my book is asking the question ....

What and who caused the big bang??...
and
Where did all those dimensions come from??

#ni-1 #ni-1


Perhaps the day man answers those questions will become god..... Anyway, they are beyond my reachness, and, as far as I know, are still far away from today's science. But man has made big inventions and great explorations since our first ancestor left mdern Africa and colonized the world. Maybe some day we will surprise ourselves.


Something I have found and agree with:
http://www.nap.edu/html/creationism/

P.D. as for your question, I remember having read some years ago taht big bang was caused by a fluctuation of energy, though i really can't understand it... There was not matter (well...), there was no space (uffff... ok, there were no dimensiosn also...... too much for me)
And about dimensions, how many of them are? 4, 10, 26....? Really intriguing. I would really love to understand a little more...

Crying or Very sad
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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2007 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't have a problem with anyones religious beliefs. I have a problem with them trying to convince me that their religious beliefs follow the tenets of science when nothing could be further from the truth. I especially have a problem when such drivel replaces science in the classroom (and yes, it's happening again).

Don't get me wrong, but the LAST time there was a group of people openly discrediting the church like this, the incident rate of people falling into a pile of rope, getting tied up, and spontaneously catching on fire markedly increased.
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2007 2:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I support science and hope that this travesty ends. Creationism? What a joke! I've had enough with religions and the "know-it-all" attitude of priests and what have you! When in fact, those people should really get an education! I am horrified by the thought that this might cause another Middle Ages, and especially given various churches and religious beliefs' power in governments and such like.
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2007 5:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh no. This is going to become ugly soon.....
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Sir Hamster of Elderberry
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2007 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mohrorless wrote:
Oh no. This is going to become ugly soon.....


No, it won't. Smile

Well ... not here anyway. The essential ugliness of the debate at large, where BOTH sides ignore the real issue in favor of whacking each other over the head with the biggest argument they can find, will no doubt continue. (There's an old thread around here where I spend far too much time stating my opinions on the matter, so I won't repeat myself here.)

I take it as given that faith has a value in and of itself. There are people who take the discoveries of science to be an attack on their values, when in fact science can do no such thing. Trying to use science to validate your faith is just plain looney. Wink

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belenus
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2007 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I don't want to have any arguments. I think we post and read here to have a good time, and not to take part in futile disagreements.
Just say taht I find disappointing to hear (as in Sir Hamster's link) that, still nowadays, someone with an education and easy acces to different kinds of information, rejects scientific knolewdge for his or her religious beliefs, which I mostly respect.

Once again, I'm sorry that my bad English may cause any misunderstanding.

NnnnnnnnnnnnI
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2007 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

belenus wrote:

Once again, I'm sorry that my bad English may cause any misunderstanding.

NnnnnnnnnnnnI


I don't think you've caused any misunderstandings Sir Belenus... everyones sitting on your side of the fence Very Happy .....

the real question for me is where does science end and faith start? even scientists are calling string theory a "faith" as there's absolutely no way of proving or disproving it......


anyhow to get some discussion going mull this one over (I'm NOT a creationist BTW)....

"big bang was caused by a fluctuation of energy"

"let there be light!"

scientific fact light = energy

my point is there's absolutely no way of knowing what happended BEFORE the big bang so speculating what was there is purely faith and NOT science......


Now I've a few witches to burn, so I may be some time answering any other posts....



#ni-1
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2007 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KWSN - Sir Brian C....... wrote:

the real question for me is where does science end and faith start? even scientists are calling string theory a "faith" as there's absolutely no way of proving or disproving it......


But, don't you think Sir Brian C......., that, at least, string theory comes from a developed study of physics, and that makes it a bit different from palinly "faith"?
For me, the truth is that string theory is not just "faith", but something I can't simply understand. I try to, but I lack a certain basis.


KWSN - Sir Brian C....... wrote:

my point is there's absolutely no way of knowing what happended BEFORE the big bang so speculating what was there is purely faith and NOT science......


I agree with you. No way it came from a "fluctuation of energy" or a previous big crunch, conditions may have been very different before, and perhaps it's not possible to rewind time(?) from that singularity...... Smile
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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2007 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KWSN - Sir Brian C....... wrote:
... the real question for me is where does science end and faith start?


That answer requires liberal amounts of one of the rarest substances in the universe ...

...

... Wisdom ...

... and alcohol Shocked

That answer requires liberal amounts of two of the rarest substances in the universe ... (etc. etc.) Wink

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PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2007 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As an atheist, as I see it, religion is man's way of explaining the otherwise inexplicable. So logically as knowledge increases religion diminishes!

And if religion is the "true way" how come there are so many and that they are so different, and they all want to kill each other??

Don't throw things at me!! I am tolerant of other peoples' beliefs, if they want to talk to non existant skyfairies, then they all have a right to!
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